As a long-time fan of Rookie Blue, I was thrilled when a new lesbian character appeared in the middle of season four. I was even more thrilled to learn that this character would be sticking around, and that her storyline would revolve around Gail Peck (played by Charlotte Sullivan), my favorite character on the show. I always said that Gail had sexual chemistry even with inanimate objects, so it didn’t feel inorganic that suddenly she was now in a flirtationship with a woman, with the potential for more.
As it turns out, it wasn’t just me projecting my hopes and dreams all this time. Charlotte Sullivan chatted with AfterEllen about her character and tells us she’s been playing Gail with the possibility of this storyline in mind since almost day one.
Check out what she had to say about Gail, Holly, and queer visibility in general. I guarantee that by the end you’ll want to raise her up on your shoulders and nominate her for Ally of the Year.
AfterEllen: Thank you so much for talking to me today!
Charlotte Sullivan: Absolutely! Someone from my team forwarded me your articles, I read them, they’re amazing, thank you for writing so eloquently about the show. I appreciate it.
AE: Thank you! I’ve been a fan since the first season, so it was excited to get the chance to write about it.
CS: And this new storyline that we’re approaching is kinda juicy, so I’m excited to get to finally talk about it, because I haven’t been able to talk about it in a while.
AE: Yeah, everyone’s really excited-I’ve actually had a lot of people tell me they’ve started watching the show and got hooked on it because this storyline piqued their interest.CS: I love hearing that! Oh, that’s amazing! That makes me really happy.
AE: So, just to jump right into talking about Holly and Gail, how is it working with Aliyah O’Brien? It must be nice to have someone actually reacting positively to Gail’s antics and snarkiness.CS: First and foremost, Aliyah is a very, very cool chick. I was quite intimidated because she’s genuinely a very, very incredible woman and I’m pretty dorky, so I was nervous to meet her. There are parts of me that I put into Gail, so Gail’s kind of socially awkward and definitely a bit kind of cryptic and strange, and those are parts of myself, and meeting her I was like a blubbering fool. She’s just so vivid and very athletic and really positive, beautiful-we were very nervous and very giddy with each other, which was kind of fun.
What’s really nice about doing this storyline is, you know, they could have probably put me with another guy, because that’s really what this show is about, it’s about relationships, right? So having me pass on from Nick and go on to some other dude.. it was just a nice way to create a kind of deeper layer with Gail, which was really refreshing. Because, truth be told, if you put me with another man, it’s sort of, in itself, the same storyline again. Okay, last year it was somebody else. This creates like, who am I, what’s happening, what’s going on, and it just creates all these different, amazing different layers that, for me, as an artist, I get to play something totally different, and that’s kind of what’s been the most exciting part of it. And also the feedback has been really, quite remarkable. So that’s a whole different-it’s like playing Gail, but in a different light, it’s really nice.
AE: I loved when she was talking to Chloe and Gail said she was jealous that Chloe isn’t afraid to be herself all the time. I was wondering if I was just projecting my own story onto that or if it was Gail starting to question her own sexuality, or if it was just a general Gail reflecting on herself.
CS: It’s interesting, I think on the show we’re trying to discover what this is, and we’re not labeling it. Like, I think a lot of people are like, “What is this? Are you gay, are you straight?” And I’ve always had hints about her sexuality-you know, I talked to the writers about it, back in season one, I questioned if she was really in love with these guys that they had been putting in front of her. It was something that the writers had taken in their back pocket and kind of always toyed with the idea, and even if no one was noticing, but I would kind of play it like you didn’t know. Because she could have really been happy with men, but we don’t necessarily want to put labels on it, because we don’t know. It’s all about discovery, right? So I think with Gail, like, I just love the idea of cracking her open and kind of finding out what’s inside of her. Because even if she isn’t gay, she’s discovering something new and trying a new experience. But if she is gay, and it’s this kind of amazing journey of going through and discovering oneself. But yeah, with that quote from Chloe, it is true, Gail can’t really let her guard down with people, she has a hard time doing that. And she’s just the black sheep of anybody, she has friends, but can we call them really friends? She doesn’t really let anybody in. And so maybe with O’Brien, it can open up a whole new side of her, which is the most amazing thing to play for me and makes me so excited to work with Aliyah because it’s a lot of fun and she’s a really great woman and it’s been really kind of amazing.
AE: One of my favorite scenes, actually, of probably the whole show was when Gail and Holly were in the batting cages. It felt like it was the first time we really saw Gail genuinely laugh and have fun.CS: [Laughs] A lot of our writers when they saw that, they were like, “That, for two seconds, was not Gail, that was Charlotte.” I’m certainly not-this actually goes back to originally, when I was asked to do Rookie, my first instinct was, “No!” My God, I’m not athletic, I’m not strong, I’ve got noodle arms! If you need me to protect this city, you should be afraid, because this is not a good idea.
I didn’t have confidence, I said no-and not because I didn’t want to be part of the show. I really wanted to be part of the show, I just didn’t want to make a fool of myself and they’d fire me! That was the original thought that I had had. And David Wellington, one of our directors, was like “You don’t understand, these are not seasoned officers, these are people discovering who they are, so you don’t have to be like a muscle-woman, you don’t have to be. You are discovering, and you can be a fool.” So that kind of made things a lot easier for me. And specifically with that batting cage scene, Gail is really uncoordinated, and is awkward, but she hides with this veneer of venom all the time, because she’s afraid people will reject her and they will make fun of her, which I think everybody fears that. I don’t know if that made any sense at all.
AE: It does! And it’s great to hear that there’s a little bit of you shining through in that scene.
CS: I think if they had it their way they would have been like, “Can we redo that scene?” Sorry! I’ll play better next time! Yeah, that was very me.AE: Are we going to see more of Holly bringing out that softer side of Gail in the last few episodes of this season?
CS: This season coming up? Are you referring to this season or Season 5, which we’re about to shoot?
AE: Oh! Is Holly coming back for Season 5?
CS: I don’t know! I’m not sure! I mean, it’s kind of up-I mean, really, truly, they would never tell me, but I think because of what happens in our finale, it’s certainly a cliff-hanger. It’s quite an intense episode, which would probably lend itself to her coming back next year, because it’s literally a continuation of the following day. So, I would think that she comes back. Unless she just up and leaves me and I’m stranded and abandoned once again.But yeah, Aliyah is a very cool-I have to over-emphasize this-she really is like VERY cool. You know the people who are like, “You just put your hair up like that and it looks good!” She’s one of those people that you want to murder. Like, effortlessly beautiful. It’s so annoying. [Laughs] I just love doing work with her, so I hope that I have way more stuff with her.
AE: Do you think that Gail is really falling for her now that they’ve been spending more and more time together? Especially now that Andy kind of broke the closest thing to a friendship that she had. Or do you think that Holly is just a safety net right now?
CS: I don’t know. What’s really interesting about how they’re going to write it is, she’s very vulnerable right now. I think she really did like, she really did love Nick. It certainly had nothing to do with the fact he was man, she really did love him, and he broke her. And again, this is a man that has abandoned her a couple times. So I think being in that kind of vulnerable state, she’s discovering this really amazing relationship with this woman, but doesn’t know what’s happening. It comes back to that whole defining it thing. Which I kind of appreciate. I don’t think you have to define it, I think you just love a person or like a person, not because they’re a man or a woman, maybe they’re just very unique and there’s some kind of chemistry that happens when you’re with that person. So I’m not quick to put a label on it, I think even out of respect to the gay community.
Even when they came to me with this idea-because I had sort of brought it up a couple of years ago-the original thought you have is, “I hope you’re not doing this for the sake of male viewers.” Like, I want to please women. I don’t want to…It’s so easy to do… I don’t know if that makes any sense.
AE: No, yeah, believe me, it does.CS: You know what I mean? Two girls kissing, guys get off on that. Like, no! I want this to be something really intimate, with a lot of care. Not for the sake of pleasing a man. So, that was something that, they were toying with the idea last year, and the first instinct I had was, it would have to be for the girls. It can’t be for the guys. And then it sort of died down last year and then this year they brought it up to me again and they said they would handle it with the utmost care. And that’s when it got really exciting, because it’s not really about sexuality, it’s about Gail, it’s just about finally having a person she can be herself with. It’s a totally new side to her, and that’s what I appreciate the most about doing it. It’s just different. And I can’t stress enough-I don’t have to be with another guy again for a little while. I can be with whoever I want. And that’s my opinion-and the writers, they come up to me and ask, and you have to be a little afraid of what you say, because they’ll put it in the show. This is my premonition coming true that I had stated four years ago. They definitely listen and they also implement your ideas and literally verbatim what you said will be in the script, so you just have to watch yourself, because you will find out it’s in the script a couple episodes down the road. You’re like, oh, shit! It’s a really beautiful thing.
AE: It’s really great to hear, a lot of people were concerned that it was kind of like a ratings ploy. I’ve been watching from the beginning, and I’ve always felt that Gail has had equal hate for everyone when she’s angry, and I can see her having equal love for whoever. I think she does see people as people.
CS: Yeah, I think so, too. And it is true, you don’t want to-not to dismiss men in any way, I’m not bashing guys-but when there is something about two girls on screen and you want them to be together and you want them to kiss and it’s for the male viewership, and that’s the complete antithesis-no. That’s not what I want, I don’t want to use the gay community to get ratings, I don’t like that. I find that manipulative and strange. I want to use this opportunity to grow as an artist-I’ve never played this before. And that’s the more exciting part of it.
AE: That’s great to hear!CS: I’m talking too much and rambling, forgive me. [Laughs] But It means a lot to me, I’ve been with this character for so long, and the gay community is really important to me; my friends are gay, and getting to do this storyline has made me so happy. I have chills thinking about it, the fact that I get to this makes me so fucking proud. And I don’t know what’s going to come of it, but that’s OK. It’s just about exploring and not judging and just being true to yourself.
AE: It’s so awesome to have people like you as allies and really caring about these storylines, it does mean a lot to the community.
CS: It does! You want to be represented! I mean, come on, how many commercials do you watch where the couples are even like the black couples, and the white couples. Where is the diversity? Why haven’t we seen commercials with two women for like a toothpaste commercial? You just don’t see it and I find it so…even like women’s sports. We don’t watch women’s sports, we watch men’s sports. But, it’s a question-I’m such a feminist, pardon my rant, but my blood really boils when I think about this. That’s why I think it’s so important to represent different cultures, different ethnicities, and sexuality! It’s really important-and to do it right. And that’s what the writers and our showrunner Tassie [Cameron], she’s a friend of mine, and she said they were going to do it with the utmost care and make sure it’s represented well, and not just for the sake of men, which is just the complete opposite of what I want to do.
AE: I see we’re running out of time so I have one more question for you-I asked people on twitter what they wanted to know and one of the most common questions I got was, “When is Charlotte going to come to twitter?”
CS: [Laughs] Oh God, I know, I’m late on the bandwagon, I’m terrible at technology. I quit the internet. I really want to live in seclusion and live on the farm and not have the internet, because it gives me anxiety! I remember the show had originally asked me to use twitter a couple years ago and I didn’t quite understand the medium, I didn’t know what it was, and I think I was tweeting things that were inappropriate and they were like, “No, you can’t tweet that!” So I’m like, “Okay…” So I’m not tweeting right. I then I felt like I really wanted to respond to everyone and I wasn’t able to and then I felt like it wasn’t something fun for me, it was something that give me a bit of anxiety, so I just thought “Ugh, I’m outta here, man.” It’s just not me, I’m terrible at email, I have messages on my phone that are probably from two weeks ago, I’m really very kind of like go back to the 1950s when things were more simple. I want chickens, I want a pig, I want no computer, and I want books. So, that’s probably why I’m not on twitter.
AE: That makes sense!
CS: I’m really bad at that stuff, but I understand! It’s an amazing medium for people, I think a lot of people get a lot of positive things from it. I just wasn’t connected to the twitter thing, it wasn’t the right artistic medium for me to convey what I needed to do in 150 characters. It just wasn’t for me.
AE: It’s not for everybody.CS: I also think it’s a fad and I think it’s going to be gone! [Laughs] I don’t have a Facebook, but Facebook is fading out and there’s going to be something new, so might as well not have anything!
AE: Someday we’ll go back to messenger pigeons.
CS: Yeah, we’ll go back to snail mail! We’ll go back to the ink well and feather! [Laughs] I’m just dreaming. Pipe dreams.
AE: I don’t want to take up more of your time than we scheduled, but thank you so much for talking to me!
CS: Thank you for talking to me! I appreciate it, any time. And thank you-I’m completely gobsmacked by how supportive you are of the show and particularly with this storyline, it means so much to me. It’s a really important thing that I think the viewers are going to be happy with and the fans are going to be happy with and thank you for talking about it! It’s like mind-blowing that people care, so I appreciate it.
AE: It’s mind-blowing to us that you guys care so much about it, so it’s definitely a mutual appreciation here.
CS: Well hopefully we’ll get to talk with one another again when we start shooting season five and there’ll be more to talk about!
AE: That would be great! I do have a confession to make, I was a little nervous, because I was a big fan of Harriet the Spy when I was little, so the 10-year-old in me was a little afraid to be talking to Marion Hawthorne.
CS: Oh, you were?! That is so funny! Oh, you know Greg’s on the show!
AE: I do!
CS: You know what’s funny, his brother was on the show last week and he played a carrot in the-remember that scene that we’re all dancing as vegetables? He was in the background and he was a carrot or a celery stalk, I can’t remember. But I was like, “Wow, there are three people from Harriet!”
AE: That’s so funny!
CS: It’s really nice to get to work with Greg, I hadn’t seen him in so long. We were friends and we stayed in touch for a couple years after Harriet and we’d see each other, and then you go on to lead your lives, and I hadn’t seen him in YEARS. And he’s amazing and so lovely and he actually directed the next episode, which is a really important Chloe and Gail episode, so that’s this week. And yeah, we got to do some really great stuff, so I hope you watch and I hope you like it!
Check out Rookie Blue Thursdays on ABC at 10 p.m. EST to see Charlotte in action.
